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Post by GA-Dawg on Feb 9, 2016 1:13:15 GMT
Hi Paul,
Sorry to hear your having troubles and hopefully I will not have the same. Just out of curiosity do you mind if I ask you how much you have spent. I am just over the 7K mark and don't see a way to do it much cheaper. Just want to make sure that my post is close to accurate.
Thanks in advance
Cheers,
-GADawg
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 9, 2016 7:44:11 GMT
Thanks GA Its a complex project so i guess some challenges are to be expected, hopefully with some perseverance and help i can get this sorted. re cost i stopped counting after some time back  but id say 6-7k is about right. Things where you can cut quite a bit of costs is source motors and gearbox's from china, use cheaper VFD's, use smaller heims etc. |
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 9, 2016 22:07:10 GMT
In case its of use to others with wj200's these are my settings so far in the rough order to get things running:
1. B037 - 0 activate advanced display
2. B092 - 02 Set fan control to temp controlled
3. B083 - 10 hz PWM Frequency (goes to 15 - higher is quieter(less whine) but harder on motors, best to find balance between noise and frequency that suits you)
4. A001 - 1 Frequency source 1=Terminal control(AMC) 2-panel control (F001 speed) use for inital testing
5. A002 - 1 Run command source 1=Terminal control(AMC) 2-Panel control (start and stop buttons, for initial testing via keypad set to 2)
6. A003 - 50hz Motor Frequency (set to motor nameplate)
7. A082 - 220volt Motor Voltage (set to motor nameplate)
8. H004 - 4 pole Motor Pole (set to motor nameplate, 4 is factory default)
9. H003 - 1.1kw Motor Power (set to motor name plate)
10. B090 - 50% Dynamic brake usage in % (for brake resistor if using 0-100%)
11. f001 - Set run frequency
12 F002 - acceleration speed
13. F003 - Deceleration Speed
14. A004 - 03 3=sensorless vector mode
15. A005 - 00 (factory default)
H001 Auto tune 01 without rotation, 02 with rotation
H002 - 02 Use autotune data
can also control function of analog terminals 1-7. In our example we are using 1 and 2 for forward and reverse,
C001 00 is forward
C002 01 is reverse
can change direction here Ie Change C001 to 01 and C002 to 00 for each motor or just swap A/B wires on AMC instead (which is what i did)
its late so i may have missed some things here but there is enough to get the motor running normally so i hope it helps, i will add to this as i go.
(Thanks to steve and thanos for some of the settings)
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 10, 2016 20:54:15 GMT
Well in my quest to solve my pot centering issues i think i perfected my little pot couplers, who needs 3d printing eh  much easier than metal and welding, just pour em out of a mold.  Robust and absolutely no slipping so can discount that as my problem. Unfortunately still no further with solving my centering problem  The home position of the pot is so sensitive that even a minute shift seems enough to de-center it. Its hard to see how the motor will ever return that accurately to center, is this normal? Im actually thinking of buying a sample of the more expensive ball bearing pot to see if it helps. Shouldn't be needed as many seem to be using the pots i have but im a bit stumped at the minute. www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/6153V1A360L.5/987-1603-ND/3945834I also tried some CY cable from pot to amc, didnt make any difference, so can discount the cable as a problem. Ill keep playing with P and Acl/Decl speed but i cant really see any visible over/undershoot in the motors.?? |
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Post by mhensen on Feb 10, 2016 21:03:20 GMT
I am using the same pots and I don't seem to have an issue with tnem.. I can get to center nicely even by hand.. although I have other problems.. but that is in my own thread.. Can you otherwise try to set the A013 to 3.. sort of threshold..should be the signallevel .. default at 0.. Found it here from Mitch : motionsim.freeforums.net/thread/128/hitachi-wj200-current-errors-autotuneHope you find a solution soon!! |
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 10, 2016 21:20:53 GMT
Thanks Michael ill take a look at A013 see if it helps.
The pot center is easy to set by hand but it never returns to absolute home after rotation and difference between home or not is minute it seems.
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Post by tronicgr on Feb 10, 2016 21:31:33 GMT
Thanks Michael ill take a look at A013 see if it helps. The pot center is easy to set by hand but it never returns to absolute home after rotation and difference between home or not is minute it seems. What is the MIN motor speed setting on the Amc1280usb? It could be responsible of cutting off the speed before the target or much later than it should. Play with that setting as well, some found useful to set the min motor speed to 2 or 4. Thanks Thanos |
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 10, 2016 21:48:48 GMT
Thanks Thanos will take a look at that, min motor speed is currently 1.
In the mean time maybe some good news at last, Set A013 to 1 and the jittering seems to have stopped!!!
Motor is running smooth and responsive with no jitter and seems to be returning to home fine, you may have cracked it michael!
will confirm after more testing tomorrow but looking promising at last...
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 14, 2016 11:22:17 GMT
OK something interesting i discovered today kind of by accident. I was testing the 6dof board outputs with a multi meter to try and find out where this electrical jitter problem i have is coming from. When i connected the + and - probes of the multimeter as in the image the jitter completely disappears and the motor runs perfect. when i take the probes off and run the motor the jitter comes back again.  Thanos do you have any idea why this is, Could there be some kind of grounding issue going on? or is the multimeter creating some kind of resistance or something. also the output is registering between 0.45 and 0.8 volts even when the motors are at rest, is this correct? thanks |
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Post by tronicgr on Feb 14, 2016 16:18:10 GMT
The multimeter has some capacitance, thus its creating a LC filter where the L is the wire to the VFD.
You could try placing some 0.1uf caps same way as the multimeter, to create the same loading conditions on the analog outputs. This will filter some noise (jitter).
You could try capacitors in the range of 0.001uf to 1uf. If you had oscilloscope you could measure the frequency of the jitter and I could tell you exactly what capacitor value you would need.
Thanks
Thanos
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 14, 2016 17:50:34 GMT
OK thanks thanos ill look into it..
Where could the noise be originating from?
Would placing the AMC inside a metal housing also help with the problem? or is it coming from the power source ie mains/24v PSU?
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Post by tronicgr on Feb 14, 2016 18:10:14 GMT
The noise could be coming from anywhere. Even the lights in the room...
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 16, 2016 21:00:19 GMT
A brief update: I ordered some 0.1uf tantalum capacitors to run across the 10v analog out and ground and... IT WORKS! huge difference. (also waiting on some ceramic disc ones to try as apparently they may be better for this purpose) After some more bedtime reading i understand this is de-coupling the 24v DC supply and removing the unwanted noise which is causing the jitter. In fact from what i have read it seems every ones sim may benefit from this as all switching DC PSU's introduce noise into the system which de-coupling will clean up. indications seem to be that placing the capacitor as close to the IC output (amc) would be best but placing the capacitor across the L and O terminals of the VFD seems to be just as effective and would make it allot easier and tidy to house the capacitors there providing only one is needed. Now theres a very small blip left which i guess may be because the 0.1uf is general purpose and a different value may be better so i have ordered a oscilloscope to test (same model as you used in your 6dof output testing video thanos and was only £45). Once i identify the exact frequency then hopefully i can get the matching cap or possibly a couple of different values to place in parallel if needed. Such a relief to finally be getting somewhere with this issue. The solution posted by mitch in the referenced thread above sounds like the same problem, only mitch was trying to solve it by setting the VFD to ignore frequencies below a certain value. I tried this and it reduced the sensitivity of the motors and still only partially worked so cleaning the noise closer to source seems like the much better way. |
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Post by paulg100 on Feb 20, 2016 16:18:40 GMT
Top frame welding finished and mounted. Just finishing wood platform to bolt on top  In the mean time I managed to get a short video of the jitter issue with the oscilloscope. Thanos is this any use to identify the problem frequencies or do i need to change the settings on the scope a little? Thanks for any help! Feel so close to getting things running apart from this annoying issue. I tried tuning PID with fabi's software but because of the jitter issue i can get it to tune properly. I took the 0.1uf cap off for this video and set A013 back to 0 and B082 back to 0.5 (default settings). Even with the 0.1uf cap on its still not sufficient to solve the issue properly. This video was shot with the arm stationary and pot at 0/midpoint after returning home from a rotation via AMC on board buttons. |
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Post by tronicgr on Feb 20, 2016 19:02:16 GMT
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but id say 6-7k is about right. Things where you can cut quite a bit of costs is source motors and gearbox's from china, use cheaper VFD's, use smaller heims etc.
